Global Echo｜Glenn Stout——成功，不是25岁前必须交的作业
回声场Echora
这是Echora推出的全新播客系列「Global Echo」。我们将邀请人文学科的学者，进行半学术、半轻松的对话——内容充满专业洞见，却始终通俗易懂，旨在将人文学科的魅力带给更多人。
This is Echora’s new podcast series, “Global Echo”, We’ll invite scholars in the humanities for half-academic, half-casual conversations—packed with pro insights but never hard to follow—hoping to bring the charm of the humanities to more people.
🌟Echora Host
Adella @Adella GuGu
* Translator of <Desire and Domestic Fiction>（Chinese version）
* First Prize of the CUHK Literary Award（全球华文青年文学奖）
🌟Global Guest
Glenn Stout
* Author, Editor and Editorial Consultant
* Author of Young Woman and the Sea
🌟Echo Partner
* 中信出版社 Citic Press
🌟Global Content
你有没有过这种感觉：做着一份不热爱的工作，回到租来的小房间，不知道自己在干嘛，也不知道接下来该往哪走？
Glenn Stout 太懂这种感觉了。在成为作家之前，他是建筑工人、清洁工、棒球比赛的售票员。他在波士顿公共图书馆当了整整十年的图书管理员，利用这段时间疯狂读书、结交写作者朋友、在凌晨四点爬起来写作——因为白天他要去工地浇筑混凝土。他27岁才发表第一本书，30多岁才成为全职作家。
在本期节目中，主持人阿黛对话 Glenn Stout——《女人与海》的作者。这本书讲了1926年19岁的Trudy Ederle的故事：一个来自纽约移民家庭、听力受损的女孩，成了人类历史上第一个横渡英吉利海峡的女性，而且比当时的男性纪录还快了两个小时。2024年，迪士尼把它改编成了电影《泳者之心》。
但这场对话真正打动我的，不是Trudy游了多远、Glenn写了多少本书。而是他们在聊一个我们这一代人特别缺的东西—— 耐心 。
Glenn 说，现在很多年轻人被"必须成功"的压力压得喘不过气，父母问的不是"你喜不喜欢"，而是"能赚多少钱"。可他父母当年一次都没问过他"你怎么谋生"。于是他得以去写诗，去做那些"没有工作"的事，慢慢找到属于自己的路。他说： "耐心一点。不是所有人都能在25岁成功。我27岁才出书，30多岁才开始全职写作。有时候冬天很长，但春天总会来。"
Trudy 的故事也不是那种"努力就能成功"的鸡汤。她游英吉利海峡不是为了当英雄，甚至不是为了证明女人能做什么。她只是想证明自己能做到——给自己证明，给她最信任的姐姐证明。水对她来说不是征服对象，而是陪伴者。在那个所有人都觉得"女人不可能"的时代，她只是安静地做了这件事，然后安静地回归了生活。她没有把自己活成一个标签，她活成了一个完整的人。
聊到后来，话题滑向了AI。如果AI能写书、能翻译、能做一切，那我们还需要做什么？Glenn 说了一句话让我想了很久： "写作是一种学习的过程。如果你用AI跳过了这个过程，你就没有真正学到任何东西。"
这期节目适合在通勤路上、睡前、或者你又觉得自己"落后了"的时候听。你不是落后了，你可能只是还没找到属于你的那片水域。
Have you ever had that feeling? You're at a job you don't love, you come home to a rented apartment, and you have no idea what you're doing or where you're headed next.
Glenn Stout knows that feeling all too well. Before he became a writer, he was a construction worker, a janitor, a ticket seller at baseball games. He spent ten years as a librarian at the Boston Public Library — reading obsessively, befriending other writers, and getting up at four in the morning to write, because during the day he was out pouring concrete. He didn't publish his first book until he was 27, and he didn't become a full-time writer until his late 30s.
This week on echora, host Adella sits down with Glenn Stout, author of Young Woman and the Sea . The book tells the story of Trudy Ederle, a hard-of-hearing 19-year-old from a New York immigrant family who, in 1926, became the first woman to swim the English Channel — beating the men's record by two hours along the way. In 2024, Disney turned it into Young Woman and the Sea , known in China as 《泳者之心》.
But what really got me about this conversation wasn't how far Trudy swam or how many books Glenn has written. It's that they spent it talking about something my generation is sorely missing: patience .
Glenn says so many young people today are crushed by the pressure to succeed. Parents don't ask "Do you love it?" — they ask "How much money will you make?" But his parents never once asked him how he'd make a living. So he got to write poems, to do the things there was "no job" for, and slowly found his own way. As he puts it: "Be a little patient. Not everyone gets to be super successful at 25. I didn't publish until 27, didn't write full-time until my late 30s. Sometimes the winter is long — but spring is coming."
Trudy's story isn't some "work hard and you'll make it" pep talk either. She didn't swim the Channel to become a hero, or even to prove what women could do. She did it to prove something to herself — and to her sister Meg, the person she trusted most. To her, the water wasn't a thing to be conquered; it was a companion. In an era when everyone believed women simply couldn't, she quietly did the thing, and then quietly got on with her life. She didn't turn herself into a label. She became a whole person.
Towards the end, the conversation drifted to AI. If AI can write books and translate and do everything, what's left for us? Glenn said something I've been turning over ever since: "Writing is an act of learning. If you use AI to jump past that process, you're not really learning anything."
This episode is best listened to on your commute, before bed, or on one of those days when you feel like you're falling behind. You're not behind. You might just not have found your water yet.
🎧 Tune in now on Echora.
🌟 Timestamps
01:41 零下30度劈柴的作家，写书比种地还慢 A Writer Who Chops Wood at Minus 30°C
04:14 14岁读了一首诗，他决定这辈子不当"正常人" The Poem at 14 That Made Him Say "I Want That Power"
07:24 你可以是保安，可以是门卫，唯一不能变的就是不断写，不断交流 You can be a security guard or a doorman. The only thing that remains constant is to keep writing and communicating
09:35 凌晨4点起床写书，然后去打工 Up at 4 a.m. to Write, Then Off to His Day Job
12:12 历史书里删掉的女人，她比所有男人快了整整2小时 The Woman History Erased — She Beat Every Man by Two Hours
21:08 她不是要"证明女人可以"，她只是想跳进水里找到那个自己 She Wasn't Trying to Be a Feminist Icon — She Just Wanted to Be Herself
27:21 1000人溺亡，只因为"女人不能露胳膊" A Thousand Drowned Because Women Weren't Allowed to Show Their Arms
33:19 一个不会游泳的人，怎么写出14小时横渡海峡？ He Can't Swim. So How Did He Write a 14-Hour Channel Crossing?
42:21 "书其实早就存在，我只是去把它找出来" Books Already Exist — Writers Just Go Find Them
45:52 AI也能写传记，但它感受不到那个"灵光一现" AI Can Write Biographies Too — But It Won't Feel the Magic Moment
47:31 全纽约为她狂欢，她却选择了"查无此人" New York Threw Her a Parade. She Chose to Disappear
51:26 被遗忘的成就，还算不算成就？ If Nobody Remembers What You Did, Did It Still Matter?
54:37 那些逼你"只做一件事"的人，不会为你的人生买单 The People Pushing You to "Focus on One Thing" Won't Pay Your Bills
58:22 先成为一个人，然后才是卓越的人。至于英雄和神话，不存在的 First become a person, and then you can become an outstanding person. As for heroes and myths, they don't exist
01:04:10 你爸妈问你"赚多少"的时候，有人问过你"快乐吗" Your Parents Ask "How Much?" — Did Anyone Ask "Are You Happy?"
01:10:27 故事如何可以持久？ How can a story remain lasting?
01:16:02 如果AI抢走一切工作，我们最后剩下的只有"这个" If AI Takes Every Job, the Only Thing We'll Have Left Is This
01:18:16 重要的不是游到对岸，是你还愿不愿意下水 It's Not About Reaching the Other Side — It's Whether You Still Get In
🌟About Echora
Echora 是一个由资深人文创作者——包括译者、自由撰稿人、文学编辑等——发起的文化共鸣社群。我们致力于探索兼具思想深度与可读性的文史社科内容生态，追求深刻而不晦涩，厚重而易亲近。
我们定期在城市人文空间中举办轻松的对话聚会，通过多元视角观察、剖析并直面现实生活中的困境。愿成长的轮廓化作彼此生命间的交织之线；愿在这精神氛围中，我们能寻得直面生活的勇气。
Echora is a community for cultural resonance initiated by veteran humanities creators—translators, freelance writers, literary editors, and more. It dedicates itself to exploring an ecology of humanities and social sciences content that carries intellectual depth yet remains accessible, profound without being obscure.
We regularly craft fluid conversational gatherings in urban humanities spaces, where through diverse perspectives we perceive, unpack, and confront the plights of real life. May the contours of growth become threads weaving through each other’s lives; may we find, within this spiritual aura, the courage to face life head-on.
🌟Teams members
* Host: Adella
* Planner: Gen
* Producer: Eason @复杂生活@好状态说明书@诗无邪 Sincere Verse
🌟Music
* Rootless tree – Damien Rice
* Jets – Blur
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83 分钟
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1个月前
